Security dumb and dumber

So I go into the Tropicana in AC.

I am NOT trespassed but I know I am flagged there as an advantage player whose MO is to use other players cards.

I purposefully sit at a slot and insert a players card into the machine and start playing waiting to see how long before security shows up.

Took about ten minutes.

Three guards approached from the right, 2 from the left.

When the phalanx closes, the biggest guard who happened to be at the front of the group of three snatches the players card out the slot machine and then demands ID.

I nonchalantly hand my ID over.

The guard stares at the players card and my ID like he just ate some confusing psychedelic mushrooms.

See, I was using my own players card!

And per NJ statute, they cant evict me without cause and they just caught me doing... nothing against the rules.

The security guard handed both back to me without comment and the security circle moved off to the side about 8 feet away.

They conversed together and radioed surveillance standing there for about 5 or so minutes while I smirkingly continued to play.

I have no fear. They do!!!

Anyway....

Here is why security and surveillance is so stupid I can run rings around them all day.

Since its my card flagged, why would they rush out when I am using it

DUHHHHHH!

If I am using my own card you cant do anything.

I suppose that they might have thought I sent someone else in to use my card... but that would just qualify security and surveillance for dumbness of the year award.

You see, they turned my account activity off long time ago. While my card records win/loss, it earns no comps, no free rooms or comp dollars. Its basically a dead card as far as the players club is concerned

So lets say they caught someone else using my card.

Were they seriously going to evict someone who is playing a negative expectations slot with a dead card that earns no advantage just because the card belonged to someone else?

Just proves what dumbies they are.

And how much they truly fear me.

Fun and games of an AP!

Why do this? Your new way of staying under the radar?

Quote: SOOPOO

Why do this? Your new way of staying under the radar?

Just to prove how dumb they are.

A challenge

Plus I have the right to gamble there if I want to.

And one or two other reasons

Staying under the radar is simple. I have other people go pull offers

Quote: darkoz

And how much they truly fear me.

I'm sure their fear of you
runs as deep as their
fear of mosquitoes when
they leave at night. Just
pesky things they have to
swat away.

Quote: EvenBob

I'm sure their fear of you
runs as deep as their
fear of mosquitoes when
they leave at night. Just
pesky things they have to
swat away.

And yet how successful are we at avoiding mosquito bites?

I don't know why you find this entertaining. Victory in a casino involves winning money or else it involves an attractive female. it does not involve dumb rent a cops.

I'm oh so impressed. You managed to waste ten minutes of a couple peoples lives. Hurray for you.

Quote: FleaStiff

I don't know why you find this entertaining. Victory in a casino involves winning money or else it involves an attractive female. it does not involve dumb rent a cops.

I already do both of those

Quote: billryan

I'm oh so impressed. You managed to waste ten minutes of a couple peoples lives. Hurray for you.

Thank you.

Those ten minutes made me feel really good.

Which is what it was all about

Quote: darkoz

Thank you.

Those ten minutes made me feel really good.

Which is what it was all about

Honest question, without an insult.

Why do you feel you need to do this? And more importantly, share it?

Quote: Boz

Honest question, without an insult.

Why do you feel you need to do this? And more importantly, share it?

I find most of the APs here are so scared they live their lives in the shadows.

They will call it smart. I just see it as scared.

I dont do anything illegal so why should I be scared.

As for sharing it, why not? Anyone from Tropicana reads this what they gonna do? Absolutely nothing just like they did the other day

Quote: darkoz

I find most of the APs here are so scared they live their lives in the shadows.

They will call it smart. I just see it as scared.

I dont do anything illegal so why should I be scared.

As for sharing it, why not? Anyone from Tropicana reads this what they gonna do? Absolutely nothing just like they did the other day

Man, I don't even know where to begin.

You didn't even really answer his question, you just tried to justify your highly frowned upon actions and make yourself out to be some renegade fearless AP by dispaaging other AP's.

Please show me some proof "most of the APs here are so scared they live their lives in the shadows." Name some names and examples please. Other than people not wanting to have their name and pictures posted up, I haven't seen any evidence this is the case. IIRC even you mentioned you had made a mistake by adding TMI on the forum before you knew better. There are plenty of good reasons that's a legitimate concern for many different reasons.

You do realise theres a big difference between being cautious and being scared? I guess you wouldn't of had a bunch of cash and cards stolen if you used a little more caution.

Most people would say it's very dumb to

Quote: darkoz

I purposefully sit at a slot and insert a players card into the machine and start playing waiting to see how long before security shows up.

There might be some people who think provoking a situation where security guards might backroom you in hopes of a payday might be smart. I remember Bob N. saying if he found out someone was attempting that type of stuff he wouldn't even touch their case. I wonder if a judge or jury found out this information if it could negatively affect any future cases?

Quote: darkoz

Anyone from Tropicana reads this what they gonna do? Absolutely nothing just like they did the other day

Casino companies buy out other casinos.
I can't count the number of times I have seen casino management and other casino personal go from one casino to another. Having to get others to go pick up free play and play cards for you doesn't usually come free or without risk. If your operation is as big as you make it out to be, and given the fact that you seem to have had some sketchy people in your inner circle, I highly doubt theres no leakage going on.

So don't make it seem as if theres zero negative ramifications in bringing attention to yourself. Sometimes if you want something done right it's better to do it yourself. Sometimes plays come up that are hard to teach others or you may not want to educate them about. I guess that doesn't really apply to you since from what you have told us you basically only know how to play multiple players cards and go after free play. I personally think it's smart to think about the future and not intentionally sabotage myself so I can keep my options open.

Quote: darkoz

Fun and games of an AP!

Other AP's don't think it's a good thing for other AP's to bring attention to plays just for their own amusement.

This entire thing is slightly offensive to the people who came before you and helped change the landscape that now offers a little protection from the casinos. Just so guys like you can make us all look like A-holes just because you like to play AP games. It wasn't fun and games for all those who got backroomed, beat, ruffed up, threatened for practically nothing with very little knowledge and president set demanding big paydays if things go bad.

This reminds me of ZenKing minus all the ranting.

Quote: RS

This reminds me of ZenKing minus all the ranting.

Thats funny.

I was about to say the same thing aboit the rant by Axel one post above

Axel is right. Being diversified likely will be important to long term success. I can't tell you when, but the future of 'players cards' is limited. Biometric identification will replace them. 5 years from now? A decade? What to do then? Borrow other people's eyeballs?
Axel's point about the security guards' humanity, and you teaching them a lesson, says something about you. Something you probably don't want said. They are working stiffs, just paid to do a job. Probably would rather have a different job. When you sit down at a restaurant, and you ask the waitress to bring mustard, when she returns do you ask for hot sauce? Then when she returns do you ask for vinegar, ? Etc....?
Instead of being a dick to the security guards and the casino in general, how about being thankful that you have found a loophole that allows you to scam money from the casino so you can make a living?
In general your personal story is uplifting, but this behavior is so petty.

Quote: AxelWolf

Man, I don't even know where to begin.

You didn't even really answer his question, you just tried to justify your highly frowned upon actions and make yourself out to be some renegade fearless AP by dispaaging other AP's.

Please show me some proof "most of the APs here are so scared they live their lives in the shadows." Name some names and examples please. Other than people not wanting to have their name and pictures posted up, I haven't seen any evidence this is the case. IIRC even you mentioned you had made a mistake by adding TMI on the forum before you knew better. There are plenty of good reasons that's a legitimate concern for many different reasons.

You do realise theres a big difference between being cautious and being scared? I guess you wouldn't of had a bunch of cash and cards stolen if you used a little more caution.

Most people would say it's very dumb to
There might be some people who think provoking a situation where security guards might backroom you in hopes of a payday might be smart. I remember Bob N. saying if he found out someone was attempting that type of stuff he wouldn't even touch their case. I wonder if a judge or jury found out this information if it could negatively affect any future cases?
Casino companies buy out other casinos.
I can't count the number of times I have seen casino management and other casino personal go from one casino to another. Having to get others to go pick up free play and play cards for you doesn't usually come free or without risk. If your operation is as big as you make it out to be, and given the fact that you seem to have had some sketchy people in your inner circle, I highly doubt theres no leakage going on.

So don't make it seem as if theres zero negative ramifications in bringing attention to yourself. Sometimes if you want something done right it's better to do it yourself. Sometimes plays come up that are hard to teach others or you may not want to educate them about. I guess that doesn't really apply to you since from what you have told us you basically only know how to play multiple players cards and go after free play. I personally think it's smart to think about the future and not intentionally sabotage myself so I can keep my options open.


Other AP's don't think it's a good thing for other AP's to bring attention to plays just for their own amusement.

This entire thing is slightly offensive to the people who came before you and helped change the landscape that now offers a little protection from the casinos. Just so guys like you can make us all look like A-holes just because you like to play AP games. It wasn't fun and games for all those who got backroomed, beat, ruffed up, threatened for practically nothing with very little knowledge and president set demanding big paydays if things go bad.

Standing up for my rigth to be in a casino is not baiting for a lawsuit. Your post is actually a perfect example of caution and fear being the same thing.

Zenking was right although he went about ranting all wrong. Stand up for your rights.

Be a man. Be American!

APs would rather have their rights trampled on.

And as for your suggestion that a future play might not be possible at that location by my own self THIS IS PRECISELY WHY I DID IT.

I understand you live in Vegas where they can evict you for no reason. Sucks for you.

I dont! Here I have rights to keep playing unless an actual crime is being committed on site.

So if a lucrative play comes up that is something both legal and that I need to handle myself it is very important that I establish the casinos cannot evict me over it and depending on the play, not stop me either.

Perhaps you wouldn't be so quick to have your rights trampled if you were an AP in AC. I understand why you guys are scared in Vegas. But you guys do act scared.

Oh, forgive me, cautious.

Quote: SOOPOO

Axel is right. Being diversified likely will be important to long term success. I can't tell you when, but the future of 'players cards' is limited. Biometric identification will replace them. 5 years from now? A decade? What to do then? Borrow other people's eyeballs? .

Actually I would do what I did at a casino that required ID to collect freeplay which I hammered for six years.

I would employ people local enough and needy for work to go collect their own offers.

Their were a few bad eggs. Thats true of any business that hires employees handling cash. If they screwed me they were out. It ended up being s small ratio actually.

So this casino required ID and for six years I have handily gotten around it. In fact it turned out to be one of my best moneymakers because there was nobody claiming I broke any rules. Everyone showed up with their own cards.

UMMMM, did you say Biometrica was gonna end all use of other players cards? Gee, how fast I figured out how to get around that one

Quote: darkoz

Standing up for my rigth to be in a casino is not baiting for a lawsuit. Your post is actually a perfect example of caution and fear being the same thing.

Zenking was right although he went about ranting all wrong. Stand up for your rights.

Be a man. Be American!

APs would rather have their rights trampled on.

And as for your suggestion that a future play might not be possible at that location by my own self THIS IS PRECISELY WHY I DID IT.

I understand you live in Vegas where they can evict you for no reason. Sucks for you.

I dont! Here I have rights to keep playing unless an actual crime is being committed on site.

So if a lucrative play comes up that is something both legal and that I need to handle myself it is very important that I establish the casinos cannot evict me over it and depending on the play, not stop me either.

Perhaps you wouldn't be so quick to have your rights trampled if you were an AP in AC. I understand why you guys are scared in Vegas. But you guys do act scared.

Oh, forgive me, cautious.

How is not wanting to intentionally get security over on you just to play silly games being scared?

Quote: darkoz

UMMMM, did you say Biometrica was gonna end all use of other players cards? Gee, how fast I figured out how to get around that one

Yikes! OF COURSE if the actual humans who the free play was awarded to show up it doesn't matter what type of ID is used! But it must be way less efficient AND more costly for you that way! You are telling me it's not WAY more profitable to have one guy go with 20 cards than you rounding up all 20 individuals? Seriously?

Quote: SOOPOO

Yikes! OF COURSE if the actual humans who the free play was awarded to show up it doesn't matter what type of ID is used! But it must be way less efficient AND more costly for you that way! You are telling me it's not WAY more profitable to have one guy go with 20 cards than you rounding up all 20 individuals? Seriously?

Yes, its more profitable to handle 20 cards myself on a per card profit.

But I have to admit the heat at the other casino was zero to none and I ended up with so many people doing it the place ended up being a bigger play than expected

How is having security confront you within 10 minutes of entering the casino "under the radar?" You were pop lasered!

Quote: ChumpChange

How is having security confront you within 10 minutes of entering the casino "under the radar?" You were pop lasered!

I was over the radar at a point when being over the radar was my intent.

How does that prove anyone is dumb? If anything it proves they are doing their job, and, in my opinion, fairly efficiently from the way you describe it.

You admit to being a "flagged" player. Minutes after showing up to the casino, security interacts with you to see what you're up to. What's the issue?

I used to work in security (although not in the casino industry). If a known person, or "undesirable" if you will, showed up on our property, even if he didn't seem to be doing anything wrong at first blush, we would definitely have investigated him.

Quote: TigerWu

How does that prove anyone is dumb? If anything it proves they are doing their job, and, in my opinion, fairly efficiently from the way you describe it.

You admit to being a "flagged" player. Minutes after showing up to the casino, security interacts with you to see what you're up to. What's the issue?

I used to work in security (although not in the casino industry). If a known person, or "undesirable" if you will, showed up on our property, even if he didn't seem to be doing anything wrong at first blush, we would definitely have investigated him.

Quite inefficiently actually.

They saw I was using my players card.

They approached me

They confirmed I was using my players card (which they already knew)

Really efficient lol.

Meanwhile I have physically been inside that casino hundreds of times using other players cards (which because they are NOT in my name they never noticed)

so no they are not very efficient

Quote: darkoz

Quite inefficiently actually.

They saw I was using my players card.

They approached me

They confirmed I was using my players card (which they already knew)

Really efficient lol.

Meanwhile I have physically been inside that casino hundreds of times using other players cards (which because they are NOT in my name they never noticed)

so no they are not very efficient

What a thrilling life.

Quote: billryan

What a thrilling life.

Some people like playing pinochle for excitement

I never promised the life of an AP was a James Bond adventure

Quote: darkoz

Quite inefficiently actually....
so no they are not very efficient

So you gave them a lesson.
Will their takeaway be
'Don't mess with smart AP's'
or will it be
'When we mess with smart AP's, be that little bit smarter'

I suspect the latter.
You gave the APs' adversary some useful training. Well done. Take the kudos.

Quote: darkoz

Quite inefficiently actually.

They saw I was using my players card.

They approached me

They confirmed I was using my players card (which they already knew)

Really efficient lol.

Meanwhile I have physically been inside that casino hundreds of times using other players cards (which because they are NOT in my name they never noticed)

so no they are not very efficient

So, in other words, like I said above, they did exactly what their jobs required of them? To investigate a known, flagged player, within minutes of his arrival, and, after finding nothing wrong, leave him alone?

What exactly is inefficient about any of that? I'm still confused here...

If you think that was inefficient and dumb, then explain how an efficient and not-dumb security team would have acted in the exact same situation...

As long as security doesn't pick you up and use your head to open the exit door while throwing you out, it's all good, I guess.

Quote: rxwine

As long as security doesn't pick you up and use your head to open the exit door while throwing you out, it's all good, I guess.

One of many entertaining scenes from Casino.

This is something I notice a lot on like GWAE where they feel like they constantly have to call everyone who works in a casino an idiot compared to themselves.

I've done it too and occasionally it is perhaps warranted, like when a sportsbook that is an arm of a large transnational corporation refuses to take bets that are obviously -EV because a few people won a few thousand bucks on them. Or when the palms backed off Dana White. Oh well.

Mostly, these are just people who have low to mid paying jobs that happen to be in a casino. AP is like 15th on the list of things they are worried about. I've spent years learning about gambling while they were pursuing their own interests in life. They probably took a casino job because that's who was hiring, not because they aspired to be a gambling guru. They could just as easily worked in a car dealership. And they probably wouldn't know everything there is to know about cars if they did. They'd just show up and try to fulfill their job requirements.

then everybody applauded on the bus ride home

Quote: Rigondeaux

This is something I notice a lot on like GWAE where they feel like they constantly have to call everyone who works in a casino an idiot compared to themselves.

I've done it too and occasionally it is perhaps warranted, like when a sportsbook that is an arm of a large transnational corporation refuses to take bets that are obviously -EV because a few people won a few thousand bucks on them. Or when the palms backed off Dana White. Oh well.

Mostly, these are just people who have low to mid paying jobs that happen to be in a casino. AP is like 15th on the list of things they are worried about. I've spent years learning about gambling while they were pursuing their own interests in life. They probably took a casino job because that's who was hiring, not because they aspired to be a gambling guru. They could just as easily worked in a car dealership. And they probably wouldn't know everything there is to know about cars if they did. They'd just show up and try to fulfill their job requirements.

This post must be the reason I thought today standing in line aggravated is just waiting for your turn to be the retard aggravating everyone else.